This Auburn screwup reminds me of the NFL debacle when New Orleans was deprived of a place in the Super Bowl by a noncall of an obvious pass interference violation. I know that refs are human, but when three miss a double dribble infraction, that tells me that perhaps they should consider another line of work. Are New Orleans fans and Auburn fans now exchanging condolences?
Missed calls are a part of the game. Its a shame it happens in critical situations.
I can be the toughest guy in the building when a ref misses a call. Unfortunately, refs don't have a video replay in their head to change a call and can only review certain plays.
I did not hear anything from the 3 refs after the game, but I assume they thought the ball was tipped. That would be the only explanation other than not knowing the rules, which is unlikely in officials selected for a final four game. Amazing that all 3 refs missed it.
If this happened to the Stags I'd be going ballistic.
Last Edit: Apr 7, 2019 17:42:46 GMT -5 by paulie74
Missed calls are a part of the game. Its a shame it happens in critical situations.
I can be the toughest guy in the building when a ref misses a call. Unfortunately, refs don't have a video replay in their head to change a call and can only review certain plays.
I did not hear anything from the 3 refs after the game, but I assume they thought the ball was tipped. That would be the only explanation other than not knowing the rules, which is unlikely in officials selected for a final for game. Amazing that all 3 refs missed it.
If this happened to the Stags I'd be going ballistic.
Funny thing about the play in question was that Charles Barkley, certainly rooting for Auburn even though trying to be somewhat objective in his commentary after the game, said that he was not sure of what had happened nor really aware of the technicality of the rule. And I've got to admit, because of the unusual nature of how it played out (not your "normal" travel situation), I myself didn't even consider it a violation at all when watching it in "real time." I guess maybe the refs, like me, were too caught up in the excitement of the moment and didn't want to kill the moment with what possibly could be a questionable stoppage of play. But of course it's their job to understand the situation (not mine or C. Barkley's), therefore it is indeed amazing they all missed it. That said and in contrast to that gaff, the official who called the foul on the subsequent play was spot on and should be congratulated for not swallowing his whistle, something that wouldn't always have happened in that type of situation. Of course since both of these events worked against Auburn, yes I agree with you, if that was the Stags involved, I'd be going ballistic just like you!
To your original point though about the shame of the timing, obviously mistakes are a part of the game. Heck Virginia got a coupe of bad calls earlier which could have been the difference if they had lost. I think I remember kind of a lame 4th foul call on Ty Jerome, a call that sent him to the bench for awhile in a key point of the game. So it works both ways. And all in all I think this contest was very well officiated actually. Truth is when a game goes down to the final seconds where the competition is hard and fair and well played, one call at the end of the game should not be the thing that defines how the winners and losers feel about the evening. Great, great game, just like so many have been in this tournament!
Several of you have said you can't believe that all three refs missed the call. The fact is, on any given play, each official has a certain responsibility. They should not be (or at least should not be) looking at the same thing.
For example, one of the officials would have been stationed around the end line, under Virginia's basket (he is the Lead official). He is not watching the ball handler or anything at half court. The primary responsibility for this play is the "trail" official. He is somewhat behind the play (i.e. trailing).
You can see in the picture below that he is right there looking at it. He simply missed it. By the way, I doubt he would have seen the relatively slight tug of the jersey from his angle.
The "center" official (who would have been along the sideline near the side of the benches) should have had a good angle to see the jersey pull, and could have made that call. I suspect he probably felt it was minor enough to not merit a call. I think he probably would have had to call an intentional foul since the defender was not playing the ball. Imagine the flak he would have taken for that. I think it was a good no call given the severity (or lack thereof) and the situation.
The center official could have made the double dribble call, but generally officials are not supposed to step out of their own area and "steal" someone else's call. Especially at a high level like this, you are supposed to trust your partner to man his own area and make the right call. That doesn't mean he couldn't have made the call, and I suspect, had he seen it as a double dribble, he probably would have overrode the trail and called it. The video also shows that he had an excellent angle to also make the double dribble call.
Thus the primary mistake was made by the trail. One could argue the center official made a secondary mistake. But the Lead official is in the clear. He wouldn't even be watching the play at halfcourt.
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Last Edit: Apr 7, 2019 9:34:20 GMT -5 by vastagman
Another question... and this one has bothered me for years... not just yesterday.
After Virginia hits the shot to make it 61-60. They are able to foul an Auburn player without Auburn ever passing the ball in bounds and 0.0 time running off the clock. OBVIOUSLY, if this is a legal play then EVERY college team in the country (when they get into 'need to foul' situations) would hold/grab/push or otherwise foul the worst FT shooter on the other team after a made basket - in that situation. As this isn't some rare situation (one team wanting to intentionally foul) - probably happens in 1/3 of college basketball games (I'm guessing)... me as the basketball savant has thought of this before and wondered why it wasn't common practice. I thought the answer I had found was this: refs should award 2 shots and keep possession. If that isn't the case... then please explain to me why teams haven't been doing this for decades?
Yes - ref should've called the shirt tug before the double-dribble... after all... Auburn had fouls and was TRYING to foul at that point
As much as we can rightly praise (because of slo-mo replay) the ref that called the final foul for getting it correct... I don't think even the Virgina player who shot the ball (and most fans) expected a non-brutal foul to be called at that point... only getting 1/3 or 1/4 calls correct in the final seconds isn't too impressive!
^To answer my own question about the "0.0 time off the clock foul" not being 2 shots and the ball... it appears the NCAA may leave just enough wiggle room for a ref to not make the call... even though everyone knows the defender's goal is to play as physical as possible going for a steal... and if it happens to result in a foul... that's the plan anyway. Sounds like the NBA and FIBA see it differently.
Another question... and this one has bothered me for years... not just yesterday.
After Virginia hits the shot to make it 61-60. They are able to foul an Auburn player without Auburn ever passing the ball in bounds and 0.0 time running off the clock. OBVIOUSLY, if this is a legal play then EVERY college team in the country (when they get into 'need to foul' situations) would hold/grab/push or otherwise foul the worst FT shooter on the other team after a made basket - in that situation. As this isn't some rare situation (one team wanting to intentionally foul) - probably happens in 1/3 of college basketball games (I'm guessing)... me as the basketball savant has thought of this before and wondered why it wasn't common practice. I thought the answer I had found was this: refs should award 2 shots and keep possession. If that isn't the case... then please explain to me why teams haven't been doing this for decades?
Yes - ref should've called the shirt tug before the double-dribble... after all... Auburn had fouls and was TRYING to foul at that point
As much as we can rightly praise (because of slo-mo replay) the ref that called the final foul for getting it correct... I don't think even the Virgina player who shot the ball (and most fans) expected a non-brutal foul to be called at that point... only getting 1/3 or 1/4 calls correct in the final seconds isn't too impressive!
I remember a game in the 1986 season where Fairfield had a small lead as the game clock was winding down. The opponent was in a fouling situation and wanted to foul Andy Woodtli, who was at the point in the season shooting 25% from the free throw line. (Andy finished his career with a .400 free throw percentage (22-55) perhaps making him the worst foul shooter in the history of the program). The first time Woodtli was fouled away from the ball the refs did not call it, and Wynder got the inbound and made his foul shots. On the next inbounds play, the opposing coach instructed his player in a voice that the entire arena could hear, to grab woodtli by the waist and "throw him to the ground" before the ref even hands the inbounder the ball. And that is what they did and Andy went to the line and missed both shots.
And Fairfield Nearly lost that game. So I have always wondered why we don't see this sort of thing more. Its not a new concept, but yet we rarely see it.
Another question... and this one has bothered me for years... not just yesterday.
After Virginia hits the shot to make it 61-60. They are able to foul an Auburn player without Auburn ever passing the ball in bounds and 0.0 time running off the clock. OBVIOUSLY, if this is a legal play then EVERY college team in the country (when they get into 'need to foul' situations) would hold/grab/push or otherwise foul the worst FT shooter on the other team after a made basket - in that situation. As this isn't some rare situation (one team wanting to intentionally foul) - probably happens in 1/3 of college basketball games (I'm guessing)... me as the basketball savant has thought of this before and wondered why it wasn't common practice. I thought the answer I had found was this: refs should award 2 shots and keep possession. If that isn't the case... then please explain to me why teams haven't been doing this for decades?
Yes - ref should've called the shirt tug before the double-dribble... after all... Auburn had fouls and was TRYING to foul at that point
As much as we can rightly praise (because of slo-mo replay) the ref that called the final foul for getting it correct... I don't think even the Virgina player who shot the ball (and most fans) expected a non-brutal foul to be called at that point... only getting 1/3 or 1/4 calls correct in the final seconds isn't too impressive!
I remember a game in the 1986 season where Fairfield had a small lead as the game clock was winding down. The opponent was in a fouling situation and wanted to foul Andy Woodtli, who was at the point in the season shooting 25% from the free throw line. (Andy finished his career with a .400 free throw percentage (22-55) perhaps making him the worst foul shooter in the history of the program). The first time Woodtli was fouled away from the ball the refs did not call it, and Wynder got the inbound and made his foul shots. On the next inbounds play, the opposing coach instructed his player in a voice that the entire arena could hear, to grab woodtli by the waist and "throw him to the ground" before the ref even hands the inbounder the ball. And that is what they did and Andy went to the line and missed both shots.
And Fairfield Nearly lost that game. So I have always wondered why we don't see this sort of thing more. Its not a new concept, but yet we rarely see it.
I'm not clear on the rules but would also like some clarification here. Do today's rules on flagrant fouls discourage this?
I would think a hard fouling someone, especially away from the ball might result in foul shots and the ball.
Post by nittanystag on Apr 7, 2019 21:06:06 GMT -5
Regardless of the controversy at game's end, let's not forget that the VA kid still had to step to the line and make all 3 free throws – which he did, unlike the Auburn kid who only hit one of two a few moments prior.
The tweet below indicates the importance of coaching and player development in creating a winning basketball program.
Matt Wells @ttucoachwells Texas Tech starting 5 Tariq Owens - 185th in 2014 3⭐️ Jarrett Culver - 312th in 2017 2⭐️ Davide Moretti- 132nd in 2017 3⭐️ Norense Odiase - 358th in 2014 2⭐️ Matt Mooney- Unranked 0⭐️
Out of that five, Culver is the one who was selected to the AP all-America second team this year.
Jay Young has been credited with developing the interior players at Stony Brook and Rutgers. I'm looking forward to seeing how our current and incoming interior players improve in the coming years.
Regardless of the controversy at game's end, let's not forget that the VA kid still had to step to the line and make all 3 free throws – which he did, unlike the Auburn kid who only hit one of two a few moments prior.
Kyle Guy, ICE MAN and made a clutch 3 from the corner right before.